Re: initiative

[Karen Canty <kscanty@PACBELL.NET>]

Kathie,

Initiatives can also be constitutional amendments in Ca  - and usually the
amendment/statue will require a 2/3 vote of both houses in Sacramento to
overurn/change any part of it...

Karen

-----Original Message-----
From: Assessment Reform Network Mailing List
[mailto:ARN-L@LISTS.CUA.EDU]On Behalf Of Humes-Schulz
Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 12:09 PM
To: ARN-L@LISTS.CUA.EDU
Subject: Re: initiative


Speaking of manipulative little creeps -- the reason I think Initiatives are
dangerous, IMHO, is that it is cheaper/easier for a group to buy an
initiative than to buy a Legislature.  And, in some states (ie Oregon), they
can be written into the Constitution so that it is much harder to undo than
do.

kh

-----Original Message-----
From: Assessment Reform Network Mailing List
[mailto:ARN-L@LISTS.CUA.EDU]On Behalf Of Margaret Davis
Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 11:42 AM
To: ARN-L@LISTS.CUA.EDU
Subject: Re: initiative


WOW...Kathie,
      thank you... you have saved me an enormous amount of time.

those manipulative little creeps....   this is so interesting.  WELL...we
know TEXAS won't go for this...we LOVE to see our representatives votes FOR
THE RECORD and our reps LOVE the attention...but it sure seems to make it
hard for anything that ever does finally become law to be fine tuned.  we
have to live with what seems like the *rough* draft for several years before
we ever get any relief!!!

now to figure out how we can get rid of BAD LAW altogether?

I'll go check out which *groups* want to see this happen....thank you for
the links
~~~~~~
Margaret
There may be times when we are powerless to prevent injustice, but there
must never be a time when we fail to protest. -Elie Wiesel, writer, Nobel
laureate (1928- )
http://aisdinuniforms.org


----- Original Message -----
From: "Humes-Schulz" <humes-schulz@ATTBI.COM>
To: <ARN-L@LISTS.CUA.EDU>
Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 1:05 PM
Subject: Re: initiative


> Margaret,
>
> The Initiative Process (in the 24 states where it exists) allows voters to
> directly enact laws -- the legislature and governor are bypassed.  The
> process is something like this:
>
> 1.  Write an initiative and submit it to the Secy. of State (the office in
> charge of elections, usually).  Anybody can do this.  When certified as to
> format and language by the Secy. of State, you go to the streets for
> signatures.    (In Oregon, the Legislature can also refer an Initiative
> directly to the voters without the signature process -- they routinely do
> this with controversial stuff so they won't be tainted with votes
> for/against it.  And they ran for the Legislature why?)
>
> 2.  Get signatures from registered voters supporting the initiative  --
> usually a specified % of registered voters is required, some states
require
> them to be from all counties, some don't care.  Most states allowed paid
> signature gatherers (i.e. the group sponsoring the amendment can hire
> signature gathers to go door to door or gather at local public spots, i.e.
> the library, to get signatures).  Usually, you need about 120% of the
> required number of signatures because of fraudulent or counterfeit sigs,
> duplicates, and non-registered voter sigs.
>
> 3.  Get initiative certified by Secy of State.  Submit all the sigs to the
> office of Secy of State, they peruse the sigs by some process to establish
> validity.  If you get the right amount of legitimate sigs, you are on the
> ballot.
>
> 4.  Wage a campaign.  The campaign is simple:  do you favor Ballot Measure
> 258 or not?  Yes or No.  If yes, it becomes law.  (unless the loser wages
a
> lawsuit which often happens).
>
> So that's it in a nutshell.  Good idea in theory -- grass roots politics,
> give the power to the people instead of out-of-touch legislators.  In
> practice (in my always humble opinion) it is interest group politics at
its
> worst -- allows well funded groups to circumvent the normal vetting and
> debating process and a lot of bad law with lots of unintended consequences
> gets passed.  And a lot of unfunded mandates get enacted this way.
>
> And apparently, folks are trying to get direct binding initiatives for
> Texas, too.  See http://www.initiativefortexas.org/
>
> For more info, see "How Interest Groups us the initiative Process in
> California"
>  http://www.ppic.org/publications/PPIC115/pp.rb115.html
>
> Oregon's Supreme Court just tossed out an initiative yesterday see
>
http://www.oregonlive.com/newsflash/oregon/index.ssf?/newsflash/get_story.ss
> f?/cgi-free/getstory_ssf.cgi?a0855_BC_Oregon-TermLimits&&news&ornews
>
> and David Broder's book:  "Democracy Derailed : Initiative Campaigns and
the
> Power of Money"
>
> Speaker's Commission on the California Initiative Process
> http://www.cainitiative.org/
>
> Kathie Humes
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Assessment Reform Network Mailing List
> [mailto:ARN-L@LISTS.CUA.EDU]On Behalf Of Margaret Davis
> Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 6:37 AM
> To: ARN-L@LISTS.CUA.EDU
> Subject: Re: initiative
>
>
> Thank you very much Doug.
>
> I would sign your initiative in a heartbeat but I don't live in
> Washington.....does that matter?
>
> I will start looking at our Secretary of State's Website.  Sadly
enough...i
> have no idea who that is......oh geeesh... here i go on *another* learning
> adventure.   Where did you find a copy of a successful initiative?  And
what
> happens to it after you complete the requirements?  Does it become a
mandate
> without having to go thru both houses and end up on the governor's desk?
> sorry i have so many questions i'm just fascinated.
>
>
> Margaret
> http://aisdinuniforms.org
> ~~~~~~~
> It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong. -Voltaire,
> philosopher (1694-1778)
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Doug Selwyn" <dselwyn@ANTIOCHSEA.EDU>
> To: <ARN-L@LISTS.CUA.EDU>
> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2002 11:43 PM
> Subject: Re: initiative
>
>
> > Sorry Margaret,
> >
> > didn't know how much detail you wanted.  We wrote up our initiative
> > patterned after a successful one in terms of format and such.  There are
> > instructions about how to do that on the secretary of state's web site.
> > We then had a lawyer look at it, to make sure it wasn't too out of line
> > with what the state considers constitutional. when he got done laughing
he
> > said it looked ok to him.
> > The filing instructions are also on line.  I don't remember exactly who
> > you take it to in Olympia, but it's an office at the capitol.  Since I
> > didn't physically take the initiative down to Olympia I dont know who
> > exactly gets them.  But the state government, once they receive these
> > puppies takes a look at them, okays them in terms of meeting the
> > requirements (again spelled out in the instructions onthe state web
site),
> > assigns it a number and an official title, and you're good to go.
> > if you log on to the state of washington web site there is a link for
> > informaiton about preparing and filing initiatives.  we then have six
> > months to gather about two hundred thousand signatures, so the quicker
we
> > get out of the chute the better.  we'll be ready as soon as we get the
> ok..
> >
> > doug selwyn
> >
>
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