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Re: Fw: [eddra] C-Span Program (Fighting Back)

You mean that in the summer before the election, Democratic leaders are not falling all over themselves to promote a signature law of the Bush administration? What can Miller and Kennedy be thinking?

Your claptrap about "Disaster Capitalism" and the "usual suspects" and "some voucher proponents" does not in any way support a claim that NCLB is now or ever has been a tool for destroying public education. The fact that people were proposing drastic interventions in schools since the early 90s undercuts the argument that NCLB was sprung out of the blue by the Bush administration, test publishers, the Business Roundtable, and who knows what other little green men.

Art

-----Original Message-----
From: GERALD BRACEY <gbracey1@verizon.net>
To: arn-l@interversity.org
Sent: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 9:31 am
Subject: Re: [arn-l] Fw: [eddra] C-Span Program (Fighting Back)

I think that those who saw NCLB as a means of privatizing schools were
operating from the Politics of Disaster or, as Naomi Klein puts it, Disaster
Capitalism. They were opportunists. Recall that the original bill called
for vouchers usable at private schools, which, at the time, some voucher
proponents thought would spring up just like gas stations and fast food
restaurants. 
 

Miller is no longer behind it. He has seen its problems. "I can tell you
there are no votes in the U. S. House of Representatives for continuing NCLB
without making serious changes to it...What I really want is to be the proud
co-author of a law that works" (from a Miller speech, July 30, 2007).
Kennedy dropped it functionally as soon as Bush failed to fund it at proper
levels (no level would ever make it work). 
 

I say that the capitalists were simply opportunists because the educational
world was moving very much in the direction of NCLB at least as it pertained
to poor kids. 
 

Consider this: 
 

"As to schools that fail to make adequate progress, the enforcement process
initially will involve a series of graduated stateps to be taken after a
school is identified as failing, but before sanctions are imposed--including
technical assistance, consultations in the school community about corrective
steps, and visits from an inspection team that can requisition any needed
resources--should enable many schools to come into compliance without the
imposition of sanctions. 
 

"Where school systems continue to fail, despite assistance, sanctions may
include institutional penalties uch as loss of decision-making authority
and, ultimately, claosing the school, as well as individual penalties, such
as reductions in pay and dismissal and/or transfer of the principal and
other staff." 
 

That is from the "Enforcement" section of "Making Schools Work for Children
in Poverty, the report of the Commission on Title I, often called the
Hornbeck Commission for Dave Hornbeck, the former Philly Supt who chaired
it. 
 

December 1992. 
 

All you need to do to get to NCLB is to lay out a timetable for progress
(AYP), specify precisely what constitutes a failing school, specify more
concretely the sanctions and set up a calendar for them, too. 
 

While some of the members of the commission were the usual suspects--Kati
Haycock, Marc Tucker, and Cynthia Brown, for instance, many were not: Henry
Levin, Hayes Mizell, Joe Nathan, Bella Rosenberg, Ramsay Selden, Bob Slavin,
Mike Smith, and Anne Wheelock (this is not an exhaustive list). 
 

You can get the 31-page document itself via Google, but I didn't see any
listing for the document with commission commentary and supplementary
statements of individual members such as George, Bella and Anne, all of whom
obejected to varius components, especially the assessment system which they
saw as unworkable. The Commission argued for performance tests that would
measure higher-order skills. Ha. George Miller has currently plumped for
the same stuff. 
 

I don't recall how I got the full document, but I think it was through my
JSTOR access via AERA. 
 

You definitely want the full document if you can get it. 
 

The document that contains the commission's proposals is ERIC ED 362 618. 
 

The document that contains the proposals and commentary (about 3 times as
long) is ERIC ED 373 120. 
 


Jerry 
 

----- Original Message -----
From: <aburke5054@aol.com> 

To: <arn-l@interversity.org> 

Sent: Friday, July 04, 2008 10:32 AM 

Subject: Re: [arn-l] Fw: [eddra] C-Span Program (Fighting Back) 
 


You think you're being flattered because someone finds your argument 

incredible? Flat-earth theorists must be basking in the glow all over 

the place. 
 

Taking Susan Neuman at face value might show that some of the law's 

misguided supporters had bad intentions. But that does not mean that 

is why the law came about or that the law is working as a tool to 

destroy public education. You are still left with the fact that the 

nation's leading civil rights groups are standing by NCLB's 

accountability provisions - the very part of the law that you claim is 

destroying public education - that Miller and Kennedy are behind it, as 

are many liberal and progressive groups, and the nation's leading media 

don't see NCLB as a tool to destroy public education. 
 

You are also left with the facts that more money is going to public 

education and that the public is reasonably satisfied with public 

education. Charles Barone, who served as a staff director for Miller 

and for the House committee and who actually wrote parts of NCLB, gives 

no credence to Neuman. During the campaign, Hilary Clinton said she 

herself wrote the teacher-quality part of NCLB. In the face of all 

this, am I really supposed to believe that the last word on NCLB 

belongs to Susan Neuman? Jerry says to take her testimony to the bank 

because she was there, but, sorry, this is beyond incredible. 
 

Art 
 

-----Original Message----- 

From: Tauna Rogers <taunar@plateautel.net> 

To: arn-l@interversity.org 

Sent: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 8:22 pm 

Subject: Re: [arn-l] Fw: [eddra] C-Span Program (Fighting Back) 
 


Gosh Art, I'm flattered. I was worried my idea was stupid and too 

forward of 

me, yet you found my post "totally incredible". 
 


Have you forgotten Susan Neuman and Time magazine? I think Neuman has 

barely 

touched the tip of the iceberg, which is not to say that I don't think 

some 

of the lnaw's misguided supporters had good intentions. 
 


Please don't bother with your next smart-alecky remark. 
 

 

----- Original Message ----- 

From: <aburke5054@aol.com> 
 

To: <arn-l@interversity.org> 
 

Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2008 9:13 PM 
 

Subject: Re: [arn-l] Fw: [eddra] C-Span Program (Fighting Back) 
 

 

Do you really believe that if NCLB had the horrible effects you say 

it has 

and that if it really were a tool to discredit and privatize public 

education, the nation's leading newspapers would not have caught on, 

so 

much of the nation's civil rights establishment would not have caught 

on, 

so many African-American and Hispanic parents would be supporting it, 

and 

George Miller and Ted Kennedy would be supporting it? I find this 

totally 

incredible. 
 

 
 

Art 
 

 
 

-----Original Message-----  

From: Tauna Rogers <taunar@plateautel.net> 
 

To: arn-l@interversity.org 
 

Sent: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 10:29 am 
 

Subject: Re: [arn-l] Fw: [eddra] C-Span Program (Fighting Back) 
 

 
 

I could only stomach it in small doses. I listened to just a bit of 
 

Hanushek, all of what Ladd said, and nothing from Bennett. I noticed 

ED in 
 

'08 was behind the fear mongering event. 
 

 
 

How can we fight back and get some media coverage of our own to 

expose the 
 

myths and propoganda they are perpetuating? The massive scapegoating 

and 
 

efforts to undermine support for public education? As the election 

nears, 

we 
 

can expect much more of this ED in '08 funded (choose your naughty 

word). 
 

And of course it isn't just ED in '08. 
 

 
 

Maybe I'm naive and please forgive me if the following is 

presumptuous of 

me 
 

but I just want to put something out there to kick around. I noticed 

C-Span 
 

accepts suggestions for events to cover. There are any number of 
 

organizations and individuals seeking to save and strengthen public 
 

education and democracy. A number of you on arn and eddra alone are 

experts, 
 

more than qualified to debunk and expose the propaganda. A lot could 

be 
 

exposed about NCLB too.Would it be practicable to unite, pool 

resources, 

and 
 

organize an event for coverage? 
 

 
 

If I'm being stupid here, let me down easy! 
 

 
 

Tauna 
 

 
 

 
 

----- Original Message -----  

From: "Monty Neill" <monty@fairtest.org> 
 

To: <arn-l@interversity.org> 
 

Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2008 8:16 AM 
 

Subject: Re: [arn-l] Fw: [eddra] C-Span Program 
 

 
 

 
 

not mine - I won't watch it either - was Solomon's critique. Be 

well, 
 

Monty 
 

----- Original Message -----  

From: "Horace B Lucido" <hbl04@csufresno.edu> 
 

To: <arn-l@interversity.org> 
 

Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 4:56 PM 
 

Subject: Re: [arn-l] Fw: [eddra] C-Span Program 
 

 
 

 
 

Monty, 
 

Watch this program? Why get sick on such a nice day? I would much 
 

rather 
 

read your take....at least I got a good laugh out of that. Your 
 

honest 
 

appraisal is enough for me. 
 

Rog 
 

 
 

Rog ( Horace ) Lucido, Physics Instructor, Ret. 
 

Program Evaluator 
 

Adjunct Faculty, Fresno Pacific University 
 

Educational Consultant 
 

Educators and Parents Against Testing Abuse ( EPATA ) 
 

Assessment Reform Network Central Valley Coordinator 
 

Phone: 559-277-1312 
 

Cell: 559-355-4215 
 

email: lucid4@cvip.net 
 

 
 

 
 

----- Original Message -----  

From: Monty Neill <monty@fairtest.org> 
 

Date: Wednesday, July 2, 2008 11:47 am 
 

Subject: [arn-l] Fw: [eddra] C-Span Program 
 

To: ARN-L <arn-l@interversity.org>, arn2-strategy 
 

<arn2-strategy@yahoogroups.com>, ndsgroup@yahoogroups.com 
 

 
 

 
 

----- Original Message -----  

From: mbsolomon@aol.com 
 

To: eddra@yahoogroups.com 
 

Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 2:11 PM 
 

Subject: [eddra] C-Span Program 
 

 
 

 
 

 
 

In case you missed it, C-Span aired a 4-hour program on the 
 

Economic Implications of the Crisis in American Education 
 

 
 

Notice that the title tells you that it was not intended to be an 
 

analytical discussion, but instead to try to explain why American 
 

education is broken. 
 

 
 

Unbelievably, they chose Bill Bennett, the great educational 
 

bloviator and Eric Hanushek, the thin-air economist to help bash 
 

public education. 
 

 
 

You can watch the entire 4 hours below, but I want to simply, 
 

quickly, point out how inane some of this stuff is. Hanushek, for 
 

example thinks that if there is a correlation between two 
 

variables, it proves cause and effect---and he gets to choose 
 

which variable is the cause and which is the effect. He offered 
 

the vacuous proposition that if the U.S. schools could improve 
 

test scores by a small amount, it would raise the gross national 
 

product such that it would pay for all of education in America 
 

(at 2:20). He further told his audience that if the schools could 
 

get rid of the worst 10% (as I recall) of teachers, U.S. students 
 

would be near the top in international tests. 
 

 
 

Of course, Bill Bennett gives rise to projectile vomiting, so you 
 

should skip his blathering from 1:31 to 2:05. The bright light of 
 

the entire show was Helen Ladd from Duke University who brought 
 

some light into a reasonably dark day. 
 

 
 

The program can be seen at: 
 

 
 

rtsp://video1.c-span.org/15days/e062708_education.rm 
 

 
 

 
 

 
 

 
 

 
 

 

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