Re: Justification for the SAT

[Judi Hirsch <judih@OUSD.K12.CA.US>]

the whole question of grades is a can of worms. IF we could all
agree---which I don;t think we could---then PERHAPS a more "meaningful"
grade would make sense. For the time being, each of us must act alone,
whether we like to admit it or not.
    when I give grades, I think first of the immediate effect on the
student, and secondly of the effect it will have on the parent and whether
it will result in harm to the student; I also think about how it will "look"
on my student's transcript.
    If giving a "good" grade reinforces good habits, I give it. To me, good
grades have to do with effort, perseverence, respect for self and others,
willingness to struggle, increased confidence, etc. I do not give "tests"
per se, and have NEVER been disappointed by ANY of my students in the sense
that my "inflated" grades harmed them. On the contrary, thre have been
teachers (actually only one) who gave out C's, D's and F's which seriously
harmed low income African American and Latino students. My students have
learned that it's the day-to-day  experience of learning that's important,
not the grades.  I also use a kind of rubric that is individualized and
supportive of each student's efforts.
    I would welcome a national 3-5 point rubric that we could use and the
students could, too.
Judi

----- Original Message -----
From: Dr. William C. Cala, Ed.D. <wcala@SERVTECH.COM>
To: <ARN-L@LISTS.CUA.EDU>
Sent: Saturday, September 01, 2001 9:10 AM
Subject: Re: Justification for the SAT


> I would agree that the elimination of letter and numerical grades and the
> use of narrative would be an improvement.  There is research on
information
> retention when narrative evals are used in lieu of number and letter
grades.
> From a motivational standpoint, grades are a negative (see Richard Ryan
et.
> al. University of Rochester).  The extrapolation that teacher evaluations,
> however, are worse than company standardized tests will not hold water.
> Teachers know their kids.  Your language in your post sounds like teacher
> bashing and also sounds like you need to engage more teachers.
>
> BC
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Eric Crump" <ecrump@INTERVERSITY.ORG>
> To: <ARN-L@LISTS.CUA.EDU>
> Sent: Saturday, September 01, 2001 10:17 AM
> Subject: Re: Justification for the SAT
>
>
> > On Sat, 1 Sep 2001, Stephen McGinnis wrote:
> > > The fundamental problem is the inherent bias in the assessment reform
> > > community.  There is an unquestioned belief that somehow teachers
assign
> > > grades in a perfect manner that never contains bias.
> >
> > Not entirely unquestioned. I may be in the minority, but I think grades
> > are worse than tests. A number of reasons, including: They are
inherently
> > and profoundly subjective evaluations disguised as objective by people
> > (teachers) who really ought to know better. They are more deeply
embedded
> > in the education system, so deeply, I think, that they might be
considered
> > part of its bones (therefore reform of evaluation is difficult because
> > people rightly sense that if you pull grading out the whole skeleton
will
> > implode).
> >
> > If you (or anybody else) is interested, I host a discussion list on the
> > subject of (un)grading. We talk about the history of grading, the
problems
> > with grading, and plot for the demise of grading.
> >
> > http://www.interversity.org/lists/ungrading
> >
> > or send email to majordomo@interversity.org and in the message body put:
> > subscribe ungrading
> >
> > Holler if you run into trouble or have questions.
> >
> > --Eric Crump
> >
>
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