Re: Rate 5 applicants to a school; see who really gets in
- Subject: Re: Rate 5 applicants to a school; see who really gets in
- From: Victor Steinbok <Victor.Steinbok@VERIZON.NET>
- Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2001 01:53:28 -0400
- In-reply-to: <038001c14647$97b61740$6401a8c0@synapse>
- Reply-to: Assessment Reform Network Mailing List <ARN-L@LISTS.CUA.EDU>
- Sender: Assessment Reform Network Mailing List <ARN-L@LISTS.CUA.EDU>
At 9:56 PM -0700 9/25/01, Gabie Gedlaman - AZ Standards wrote:
You guys have to look at this fascinating webpage:
And from another interview--this one with Christopher Jencks:
[Int] Do the SAT's do a good job of predicting academic performance?
[Jen] I think they really don't do a good job of predicting. They do
a pretty poor job of predicting, but they're the best we've got.
Well that means the people who are good at those things, high school
grades and test taking, are going to do well in getting into good
colleges. And other people who would do equally well in college are
just not going to make it because we have no way of picking out the
kid who will do well, even though his high grades weren't so great
and even though his SAT scores weren't so great.
There are lots of kids out there like that and on the average they
won't do as well as the other ones and the ones who will, are going
to lose out because we can't identify. They come with little tags.
If we knew what else it was--if we could say, 'well, it's
stick-to-itiveness or, it's getting excited by a teacher or
something,'--then we could measure it. That would help a lot. And it
would probably help minority kids in particular because they don't
do well on these tests and they are put at a disadvantage by that,
and that's even more of an issue on the job where we know that tests
are not terribly strong predictors of job performance and we know
that lots of other stuff counts, But we don't know how to measure
most of the stuff except by hiring somebody and seeing how they do.
[Int] Would you say it's fair to say that standardized testing has
been harmful to Blacks and Latinos?
[Jen] Yes. The standardize tests that we give I do think have been a
handicap for Blacks and Latinos in the job market. They've allowed
us to measure something that a Black and Latino job applicant does
unusually badly on, and it's not that they're used deliberately just
to exclude Blacks and Latinos, but we just don't have any ability to
measure the other things that they would do better on. And it's
partly because it's most of the other things that count are easier
to fake. You know, if you say, 'well I really want somebody to be
responsible in this job.' Well, everybody can come in and tell you
how responsible they are, and you know, they can get 3 letters that
say how responsible they are too, so it's really hard to screen the
people who are responsible and separate them from the people who
aren't, although we all know that there are big differences in that
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